Confused: Cingular or ATT

On Mon, 10 Nov 2003 16:07:46 GMT, "Simon Bryquer"
<sbryquer@nyc.rr.com> wrote:

>Cingular claims that a few of their phones can take a European (by this I
>mean a chip bought in European for local use) that will allow calling in
>Europe as do the Europeans. Also they claim that roaming charges in Europe
>to call US are only 20 cents per minute while ATT claims the standard price
>is $1.28. Now is that their charge or a standard?
>
>ATT claims that is not possible use European chip because any GSM phone from
>an American provider will not allow this. By this the rep clarified by
>saying you can put in the European chip but it won't work.
>
How much do you want to bet. My Motorola L7089 bought from Omnipoint,
works just fine on T-mobile/Voice Stream with my Australian Sim, as
does the P800 I bought in Finland.

All AT&T phones are locked, and AT&T refuses to unlock them, period,
end, stop. The end result is an AT&T provided phone will not work with
anything except an AT&T sim, however i will bet you money the AT&T Sim
works just fine in unlocked phones no matter where they come from.
They may be some very old SIMs that won't work with current phones.
The early SIMS are 5V, and some of newer phones don't support 5 Volt
SIMS, but It's probably been at lest 5 years since anyone provided a 5
Volt SIM. There are other reasons to want to be rid of 5V SIMS anyway.
They don't have much storage.

>Now I'm aware that in Europe they sell unlocked phones -- do the providers
>in the US and which ones?
>
>In other words what GSM provider ATT or Cingular, provides the best GSM
>services at the best price using one phone in US and Europe with the widest
>range of calling possibilities at best price all things considered?
>
>Thank to one all for any help in these matters ---------------- Simon B.
>

An ATT GSM phone will work in Europe if it supports the right frequencies.
It will roam among several providers (in England: Orange, O2, T-Mobile, and
one other I forget) and charge $1.29 or if you call up first and ask VERY
CLEARLY then they'll set it for $0.99 a minute.

Or you can buy a used phone at CarPhoneWarehouse for $50 and a pay-as-you-go
Virgin Mobile SIM for about $20 and pay local rates. Will have a wierd
European number, though...

"Simon Bryquer" <sbryquer@nyc.rr.com> wrote in message news:<mJOrb.135767$pT1.62610@twister.nyc.rr.com>.. .
> Cingular claims that a few of their phones can take a European (by this I
> mean a chip bought in European for local use) that will allow calling in
> Europe as do the Europeans. Also they claim that roaming charges in Europe
> to call US are only 20 cents per minute while ATT claims the standard price
> is $1.28. Now is that their charge or a standard?

That's their charge.

> ATT claims that is not possible use European chip because any GSM phone from
> an American provider will not allow this. By this the rep clarified by
> saying you can put in the European chip but it won't work.

While all American GSM providers lock their phones, AT&T and Cingular
will not unlock them. The other large US GSM provider, T-Mobile,
will, after you've been with them for 90-days (although many have
reported they got unlock codes sooner if they explained they were
going overseas right away.)

> Now I'm aware that in Europe they sell unlocked phones -- do the providers
> in the US and which ones?

Providers don't sell unlocked phones, but various third parties do-
usually unlocked US phones, or "grey-market" Asian imports.

> In other words what GSM provider ATT or Cingular, provides the best GSM
> services at the best price using one phone in US and Europe with the widest
> range of calling possibilities at best price all things considered?

Answer: neither, IMHO. Look at T-Mobile. They offer more "world
phones" because they are a 1900-MHz GSM provider. Both Cingular and
AT&T are also 800-MHz in some areas, so they (particularly Cingular)
offer a lot of dual-band (800/1900) that don't include any Europe/Asia
frequencies. (Only one "quad-phone" with 800/900/1800/1900 currently
exists, but a few more are coming.)

So, T-Mo offers good rates, will unlock phones, and sells a decent
selection of lower cost "world phones." Why aren't you considering
them as well?

Another alternative if you must use AT&T or Cingular is just to buy a
cheap sub-$100 unlocked used world-phone on eBay for Euro-use and
leave the US phone at home!


> Thank to one all for any help in these matters ---------------- Simon B.

Good luck!

Todd -- and all others who answered I thank you, much appreciated. Great
advice and information. My questions are prompted by 11-24 when one can
change providers and keep one's existing phone number or I understand even
select one of your non-cellular based phone number for a cell..

I'm with ATT presently and the Cingular price structure seemed attractive,
especially the roll over minutes concept. But in view of your observations
regarding T-Mobile I will look into them.

Again thanks one and all ------------------------- Simon B.


"Todd Allcock" <elecconnec@aol.com> wrote in message
news:de37a2e0.0311112105.56501046@posting.google.c om...
> "Simon Bryquer" <sbryquer@nyc.rr.com> wrote in message
news:<mJOrb.135767$pT1.62610@twister.nyc.rr.com>.. .
> > Cingular claims that a few of their phones can take a European (by this
I
> > mean a chip bought in European for local use) that will allow calling in
> > Europe as do the Europeans. Also they claim that roaming charges in
Europe
> > to call US are only 20 cents per minute while ATT claims the standard
price
> > is $1.28. Now is that their charge or a standard?
>
> That's their charge.
>
> > ATT claims that is not possible use European chip because any GSM phone
from
> > an American provider will not allow this. By this the rep clarified by
> > saying you can put in the European chip but it won't work.
>
> While all American GSM providers lock their phones, AT&T and Cingular
> will not unlock them. The other large US GSM provider, T-Mobile,
> will, after you've been with them for 90-days (although many have
> reported they got unlock codes sooner if they explained they were
> going overseas right away.)
>
> > Now I'm aware that in Europe they sell unlocked phones -- do the
providers
> > in the US and which ones?
>
> Providers don't sell unlocked phones, but various third parties do-
> usually unlocked US phones, or "grey-market" Asian imports.
>
> > In other words what GSM provider ATT or Cingular, provides the best GSM
> > services at the best price using one phone in US and Europe with the
widest
> > range of calling possibilities at best price all things considered?
>
> Answer: neither, IMHO. Look at T-Mobile. They offer more "world
> phones" because they are a 1900-MHz GSM provider. Both Cingular and
> AT&T are also 800-MHz in some areas, so they (particularly Cingular)
> offer a lot of dual-band (800/1900) that don't include any Europe/Asia
> frequencies. (Only one "quad-phone" with 800/900/1800/1900 currently
> exists, but a few more are coming.)
>
> So, T-Mo offers good rates, will unlock phones, and sells a decent
> selection of lower cost "world phones." Why aren't you considering
> them as well?
>
> Another alternative if you must use AT&T or Cingular is just to buy a
> cheap sub-$100 unlocked used world-phone on eBay for Euro-use and
> leave the US phone at home!
>
>
> > Thank to one all for any help in these matters ---------------- Simon
B.
>
> Good luck!

I also want to add the fact that T-Mobile's roaming rates in Canada are
cheaper than Cingular's roaming rates in the United States. Or
Verizon's. Even though you may not be in Canada much, it probably means
that T-Mobile has more attractive international roaming rates,
especially since T-Mobile operates in many countries.

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